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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
 Posted - 11/11/2007 : 05:36:53 AM
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I watched Terminator the other night and, besides from the fact that the shoulder pads scream "80s" at you, I was led to wonder whether this is not (as it is often described) an action movie but a horror movie and more precisely, a slasher.
Slasher movies are defined by three things
1) the killer is almost indestructible. It just keeps going and going and going. This is certainly true of the terminator (with a non-capital t to distinguish the cyborg from the movie). It survives a hail of bullets, being run over by a gas truck, sitting in the gas truck when it explodes, being struck several times with an iron bar and having its limbs blown off (an interesting violation of the "Avoid the Limbs" rule).
2) The relationship between sex and death. This is weak in Terminator - the only two people to suffer post-coital death is Sarah's flatmate and her boyfriend.
3) The final girl. This would be Sarah Connor. In classic slasher movies, the final girl refuses to have sex and so survives. But in Terminator she actually does have it, and even becomes pregnant. So this would argue against the slasher theory. Still, Sarah Connor is - at the end of the movie - a resourcesful woman who even has the capability of giving the terminator a nice send-off with a good line.
I don't think the idea of the Terminator as a slasher movie is a priori silly. I would like to know what you think.
- Who is John Galt? -
Edit: Left out important part in last paragraph. |
Edited by - Asta Kask on 11/11/2007 07:12:11 AM
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Citizen Carrier
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
322 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 06:43:19 AM
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Hmm, an old favorite of mine. So much so that my first reaction when reading the title of this thread was, "A slasher movie? Heck no!"
I suppose I had it in my mind that labeling it a slasher movie would be to lower it to the level of "Friday the 13th". But that isn't necessarily true.
I've always thought of it as "Sci-Fi Horror". Maybe along the lines of Alien.
The futuristic backstory interludes serve to distance it from slasher movies. And it has the cautionary tales against nuclear war and humanity being subverted by machines. Not exactly Charlie Chaplin's Modern Times, but the message is in there.
None of the lead characters are teenagers, which I've always felt was a prime ingredient of slasher movies.
The final girl theory is a pretty good one, but the story pretty much demands that she be the final surviving character. Otherwise, no kid.
There is no reason whatsoever that your typical teen slasher movie couldn't end with the star quarterback of the high school varsity team bludgeoning the murderer to death with a 2x4. The formula doesn't do it that way because that's not the formula. Perhaps females convey terror better to the audience. I've always considered it a strange by-product of the feminist movements of the 60s and 70s that men were portrayed as unreliable/ineffective against murderers and women had to fend for themselves.
Finally, and this is a niggling point, but the terminator and his targets rely heavily on firearms. Slasher movies are about cutting and stabbing or using some odd appliance to kill somebody in a way nobody has ever thought of before.
You'll never look at your electric can opener the same way again!
That kind of thing.
Eh, maybe I'm just full of hot air. I think the case could be made for categorizing the movie as "Survival Horror". A label usually applied to zombie movies or video games that feature zombies. |
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 07:11:27 AM
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I think you are right. Well, that's one more theory for the scrapheap then... :)
- Who is John Galt? - |
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Terrahawk
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
644 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 08:00:01 AM
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Actually, Sarah has sex with Kyle just before the terminator tracks them down for the final showdown.
- While science has societal benefits, science is not a social virtue. - |
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Gristle McThornbody
Preeminent Apostolic Prelate of the Discipleship of Jabootu
Germany
186 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 10:30:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Terrahawk
Actually, Sarah has sex with Kyle just before the terminator tracks them down for the final showdown.
- While science has societal benefits, science is not a social virtue. -
See Asta's original point #3.
"Hi, I'm Bob Evil!" |
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Neville
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Spain
1590 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 11:13:01 AM
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I agree with Asta Kask observatios. While The Terminator may not be strictly speaking a slasher movie the similarities are there. The main differences would be the enphasis on the action / sci-fi elements and the fact that the leads are adults.
Despite this, I can think of at least two slasher-ish movies where the leads are adults, Ghost Story, where Fred Astaire and some other people are haunted by the ghost of a woman and the forgotten Stallone gem Eye see you. |
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Sardu
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1126 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 11:36:10 AM
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It would really seem to come down to a matter of the tone of the piece. I never considered Terminator as slasher pic and the similarities are certainly there. Part of the difference might be that slasher films usually have a flavor of the supernatural about them- the killer tends to have a more-than-human resilience to being killed or stopped in anyway that seems demonic. The Terminator has a superhuman quality but it's rational; we know he's that way because he's a robot and he CAN be stopped- it's just damn hard. Terminator is grounded in its own reality. Jason and Mike Meyers though- nothing stops them!
Of course, there are movies like Toolbox Murders where the killer is entirely human but the presence such killers cast is always great enough to paralyze victims to complete ineffectualness with fear, again almost as if they are supernatural. The Terminator instills fear but doesn't reduce prey like Sarah Conner out of their rational wits. You wind up with more of a Schwarzenegger vs. Predator mano-a-mano dynamic, just very imbalanced in favor of Terminator.
Actually, thinking about it Alien is a classic slasher flick, right down to the Spring-loaded Cat (tm) and Ripley as Final Girl.
"Meeting you makes me want to be a real noodle cook"
--Tampopo |
Edited by - Sardu on 11/11/2007 11:38:43 AM |
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Mark Hawley
Minister of the Sacraments of Jabootu
Canada
48 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 12:01:04 PM
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Not to mention people going off alone. The characters in ALIEN may not be drug/sex crazed teenagers, but they possess a very similar lack of instinct for self-preservation.
Actually, in The Terminator, I believe it's established that Sarah Conner is nineteen and a college student.
And the part where the Terminator kills Ginger and her boyfriend looks and feels like a slasher film, complete with a couple having sex, one getting up to leave, the killer sneaking in through a window, a dark house, etc. |
Edited by - Mark Hawley on 11/11/2007 12:06:23 PM |
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zombiewhacker
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1475 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 1:10:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mark Hawley
Actually, in The Terminator, I believe it's established that Sarah Conner is nineteen and a college student.
Right, in the original screenplay. The film version deleted these references. |
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Mark Hawley
Minister of the Sacraments of Jabootu
Canada
48 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 1:54:45 PM
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Not entirely though. When the Terminator searches her house to find a picture to identify her, he finds her student ID.
Also, in T2, which the trailers claimed was ten years later, Dr. Silberman says that she's 29. |
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Terrahawk
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
644 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2007 : 5:30:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Gristle McThornbody
quote:
Originally posted by Terrahawk
Actually, Sarah has sex with Kyle just before the terminator tracks them down for the final showdown.
- While science has societal benefits, science is not a social virtue. -
See Asta's original point #3.
"Hi, I'm Bob Evil!"
Thanks GM. My reading comprehension was top notch on that post. :-)
- While science has societal benefits, science is not a social virtue. - |
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zombiewhacker
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1475 Posts |
Posted - 11/12/2007 : 01:21:40 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mark Hawley
Not entirely though. When the Terminator searches her house to find a picture to identify her, he finds her student ID.
I remember that scene. I didn't realize that was her student ID. I thought it was her drivers license. |
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 11/13/2007 : 07:33:20 AM
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It seems that even a poor theory can generate new insights... :)
quote:
Originally posted by Sardu
Terminator is grounded in its own reality. Jason and Mike Meyers though- nothing stops them!
This, I'm not so certain about. In the original movies, Mike Meyers was a psychopath, but not supernatural. Mrs. Voorhees was an insane mother and not supernatural. And I certainly think that "Psycho" is a slasher movie, although an early example of the shape of things to come.
I think that Citizen Carrier hits the head on the nail when he says the things about firearms. On the other hand, the terminator's first murder (ripping out the heart of a young punk) is something I think both Jason and Freddy would have been proud of.
- Who is John Galt? - |
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Maxtype
Minister of the Sacraments of Jabootu
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 11/13/2007 : 7:14:38 PM
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Interesting idea.While I don't think of Terminator as a slasher,there are definetly slasher elements.Considering Cameron's B-Movie background and the sure-handedness with which the film is handled,I don't think the slasher elements are an accident.
This final mission will decide the fate of the human race.This is Operation:Final War |
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Sardu
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1126 Posts |
Posted - 11/13/2007 : 7:18:09 PM
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Well, remember my theory is that in a slasher film characters that are technically mundane still have an ability to cause terror and cause mayhem that gives a perception of being being supernatural. And the final shot of Halloween makes it essentially literal that what we've felt about The Shape over the course of the film is true: he is unkillable and superhuman. F13 was re-conned into the same situation by the sequels.
If one were to get REALLY nit-picky they could argue that Psycho isn't a proto-slasher film because it lacks body count. I think you need at least 4 kills for a slasher, preferably 5+. *g*
"Meeting you makes me want to be a real noodle cook"
--Tampopo |
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2007 : 07:10:17 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sardu
If one were to get REALLY nit-picky they could argue that Psycho isn't a proto-slasher film because it lacks body count. I think you need at least 4 kills for a slasher, preferably 5+. *g*
Well, in that case Terminator certainly qualifies - there must have been 20 or 30 cops in the big fight scene.
- Who is John Galt? - |
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