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zombiewhacker
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1475 Posts |
 Posted - 11/05/2006 : 10:10:57 PM
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Good villains usually make for good movies, and great villains often threaten to steal scenes from the movie's star. But occasionally a movie comes along that's so lopsided that the villain comes on like gangbusters, powering the movie's engine from beginning to end, whereas the colorless hero registers as little more than a dial tone. Usually, it's just a case of miscasting: uncharismatic actor in the lead, great actor playing the villain. Sometimes the script is to blame, too.
Examples: (not the most egregious, just the few that come immediately to mind)
The Rocketeer: Campbell Scott (hero) vs. Timothy Dalton (villain)
or (irony alert)
License to Kill: Timothy Dalton (as some secret agent guy) vs. Robert Davi (villain)
one more:
The Punisher (original): Dolph Lungren (hero) vs. Jeroen Krabbe (villain)
Again, I know there must be better examples out there. Care to help me out? |
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Citizen Carrier
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
322 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2006 : 10:32:20 PM
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Batman: They should've called it "Joker". He may actually have had more "on-screen" minutes.
Most Batman villians ham it up so badly they just seem to overwhelm the staid, reserve hero. Batman Begins came closest to what I consider would've made the best script possible for a Batman movie.
My idea: Pit Batman against the villains from the first Die Hard movie. People who are both competent and not insane like the traditional comic book villains Batman has to face. Or maybe a bunch of dishonorably discharged Navy SEALs, Army rangers, and Marine Force Recon guys armed with Barrett .50 caliber rifles and Carl Gustav recoiless anti-tank rifles.
Really, I hated the Burton/Schumacher Batman movies so much I wanted to make a movie where Batman just gets killed by competent, professional bad guys just in it for pure profit motive. Maybe have the Batmobile blasted to smithereens by a Russian T-90?
I'd buy that for a dollar.
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BradH812
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1294 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2006 : 10:38:40 PM
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Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves: Kevin Costner (Robin Hood, of the Muddled Accent) vs. Alan Rickman (Sheriff of Nottingham)
Any of the first four Batman movies: Batman (any incarnation) vs. the villains du jour. (Keep in mind I liked Batman and Batman Returns.)
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BradH812
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1294 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2006 : 10:41:58 PM
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Eek. Citizen Carrier beat me to the punch on Batman.
By the way, not to nitpick, Zombie, but Bill Campbell was the hero of Rocketeer, not Campbell Scott. Don't feel bad; you're not the first to confuse those two. *turning away in embarrassment*
Last Action Hero: Ah-nold got his thunder stolen by Charles Dance, the best part the whole movie. |
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zombiewhacker
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1475 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2006 : 10:50:51 PM
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See, that's what I mean! Bill Campbell was so boring I couldn't even remember the poor guy's name! (Insert smiley emoticon here.)
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Citizen Carrier
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
322 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2006 : 11:59:17 PM
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The Terminator Did Biehn say anything as memorable as when the Terminator selected from a list of possible responses his reply to the landlord about the possible presence of a dead cat?
Austin Powers, International Man of Mystery Dr. Evil gets all the best lines.
Eraser James Caan gets the better lines. "I can't believe you nailed me with this mail order sh#@!"
I always thought Gene Hackman stole the scenes as Lex Luther. How can that brain supply enough power to keep those legs moving?
Smokey and the Bandit It's Jackie Gleason, for God's sake! Absolute comedic solid gold. Burt Reynolds and Jerry Reed are mere stage props in comparison.
And finally, Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan. Montalban is still the best villain. |
Edited by - Citizen Carrier on 11/06/2006 12:00:45 AM |
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MrPorter
Preeminent Apostolic Prelate of the Discipleship of Jabootu
USA
102 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2006 : 10:51:09 AM
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Seeing Timothy Dalton mentioned (twice) brought this one to mind: to say that Max Von Sydow blew whoever-played-Flash-Gordon off the screen would be an understatement. They should've just called the movie "Ming the Merciless".
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Everything's chrome in the future! |
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Max Torque
Diocesan Ecclesiarch of the Sacred Order of Jabootu
USA
61 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2006 : 3:57:44 PM
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Well, bringing up one of my favorite widely-hated movies yet again: in Cutthroat Island, the villain (Dawg Brown, played by Frank Langella) totally blows away the hero, played by Geena Davis.
I mean, consider this exchange:
Pirate: "We can't leave yet, captain, we haven't enough food on board."
Dawg: "We need less mouths." (shoots the pirate)
How do you not love that? |
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Flangepart
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
2329 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2006 : 5:24:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by zombiewhacker
See, that's what I mean! Bill Campbell was so boring I couldn't even remember the poor guy's name! (Insert smiley emoticon here.)
Ah, i kinda liked 'em. Kept pace with Dalton. Now ya wanna comparison, The Rondo Hatton thug VS. Eddie Valentine. Try that one.
The human hero vs. King Kong! The man got the gal, Kong got the empathy. And HE's respected!
Any human in a Godzilla movie. As Joe Bob Briggs said, "In these movies, the monsters are the stars, the human actors are furniture." Nuff said.
Hummmm....are there any Dr. Who(s) that fit this topic? Not many i'd wager...
Marvin the Paranoid Android to Buzz Lightyear "Too infinity and beyond-i've been there, its rubbish!"
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 06:24:29 AM
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Battlefield Earth. Did anyone even notice the hero?
Conan the Barbarian. While Arnold makes a good job, casting anyone against James Earl Jones is a difficult task.
- Who is John Galt? - |
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RVHorror
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
532 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 2:39:15 PM
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As far as Dr. Who villains went, Davros always gave the Doctor a good run for his money.
Villains tend to be more interesting than heroes, by and large. The hero wants to do good and right wrongs, and such--to enforce the status quo, in essence. The villain usually has far more complex motivation and goals that are more "proactive" (though I suppose none of the victims would use that term). |
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hbrennan
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Philippines
1455 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 7:56:19 PM
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"Star Wars" - Darth Vader was far more interesting than Luke ever was. Hence, his being the featured character when the series came to a close.
"...yet it hadn't destroyed his brain."
re: Charles "The Butcher" Benton (1956)
http://www.henrybrennan.com/
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2006 : 04:20:19 AM
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Jeremy Irons in D&D. OTOH, he blows eberyone off the screen. I wonder what he was on?
- Who is John Galt? - |
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Flangepart
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
2329 Posts |
Posted - 11/21/2006 : 2:59:20 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Asta Kask
Jeremy Irons in D&D. OTOH, he blows eberyone off the screen. I wonder what he was on?
- Who is John Galt? -
Eye of newt?
Marvin the Paranoid Android to Buzz Lightyear "Too infinity and beyond-i've been there, its rubbish!"
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John Nowak
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1017 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2006 : 11:19:23 AM
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Oh, heck, man:
Dracula (1931) Bela Lugosi (Dracula) vs. David Manners (John Harker)
Mummy (1932) Boris Karloff (Imhotep/Ardeth Bey) vs. David Manners (Frank Whemple)
Black Cat (1934) Boris Karloff (Hjalmar Poelzig) vs. David Manners (Peter Alison)
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We've always been united in stupidity. That's why there is no hope. But, then again, when has that ever stopped us?
-- hbrennan |
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BradH812
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1294 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2006 : 11:47:25 AM
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| John, I think if a movie has the villain's name in the title, the villain will be the center of the show anyway, so he's supposed to whisk it all away from the hero. *g* How else can you explain "Steven McQueen" being upstaged by a giant oil slick in The Blob? |
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