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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
 Posted - 09/21/2007 : 10:11:30 PM
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I was recently reading reviews of bad low budget indie films. In the particular set I was reading about, a lot of mentions were made to scenes that were included in films that didn't need to be there. Mainly because the scenes in question had nothing to do with the rest of the film.
This got me thinking.
I remember a film that had a great throw away scene. It was the opening gambit in the film Wargames.
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReJ3RltihME"]Click here to see the scene I am referring too.[/url]
The scene had a cast of characters that are introduced, used and then never used again.
The purpose of the scene was to make people better understand what kind of problems the military was having with missle commanders and why the decision was made to replace them.
For such a small scene, it had a lot of character development. Michael Madsen was perfectly cast as a bookish adjudent.
The missle commander was perfect as well. From his conversations about drugs and chanting girl friends, you can get a feel for what type of person he is and who he probably hangs out with. Hippie types. At the same time, he's got a professionial streak which is why he probably got his position in the first place. He also knows that missle silo inside and out.
That's why it feels so natural when he starts the launch process but at the last minute he takes his hand off the key. For all his training, he doesn't have the guts for war.
The question I have for the group is this.
Can you name any other movies that had throw away scenes like this one?
And did they work or not work?
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"Ward, the Beaver blew up the 7-11 again."
"I'll have a talk with him Dear" |
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Greenhornet
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1791 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 4:44:35 PM
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quote:
I remember a film that had a great throw away scene. It was the opening gambit in the film Wargames.
Having worked in the missle field a few years before this movie came out, I was stunned by all the errors in this little scene:
Flags on uniforms, CHECK!
Letting the relief crew into the Launch Control Facility (LCF) before checking them out, CHECK!
Phony farmhouse, CHECK!
One-way mirror, CHECK!
Recieving revolvers at the LCF instead of the base armory, CHECK!
No calling down to the current crew by phone before getting into the elevator, CHECK!
No briefing on road conditions, CHECK!
No reading of codes to confirm identity of the relieving crew, CHECK!
I had to turn it off by the time they got the launch alert.
"The Queen is testing poisons." CLEOPATRA, 1935 |
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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 7:07:29 PM
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Green,
I am so tempted to ask a battery of questions about this profession.
Like what the heck did guys do stuck down there for hours on end? Or were handguns distributed to personel just for such a case were someone refused to follow through on a launch order.
And most ammusingly, was rocket fuel ever wasted for reliablity testing?
Or would it be best if I keep my mouth shut?
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"Ward, the Beaver blew up the 7-11 again."
"I'll have a talk with him Dear" |
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Citizen Carrier
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
322 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 7:30:39 PM
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Scene in The General's Daughter, which I roundly detest as a bit of anti-military agit-prop.
Travolta's character goes out to an Army training area in order to question a black female soldier. The scene begins with an army truck driving through the woods with explosions going off near it as it drives by.
Why is an unarmored truck driving through an artillery or mortar impact area with explosives going off just mere feet from the vehicle? Any truck driver I've known in the 15 years I've been in the Army wouldn't be just calmly driving along like that with arty rounds bursting near. Artillery rounds that likely have a 30 meter or more kill radius.
Travolta climbs up to a tower where the black female is stationed. Why she is alone, in a tower, in an area where artillery rounds are impacting isn't explained. What is it that she is supposed to be doing? Watching the trucks as they drive by with artillery and mortar nearly killing everyone aboard? Why she is wearing a soft cap (like a baseball cap), instead of a kevlar helmet in the proximity of said explosions, is also not explained.
In reality, the female soldier could've just been working in a pay and finance unit office when Travolta went to question her. The writers and directors thought this scene would look more dramatically "military" for the audience.
Having seen that movie in the company of other soldiers, it was worthy only of a good laugh. |
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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 8:59:39 PM
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Did it have anything to do with the plot?
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Greenhornet
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1791 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 9:07:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Capt. Nemo
Green,
I am so tempted to ask a battery of questions about this profession.
Like what the heck did guys do stuck down there for hours on end? Or were handguns distributed to personel just for such a case were someone refused to follow through on a launch order.
And most ammusingly, was rocket fuel ever wasted for reliablity testing?
Or would it be best if I keep my mouth shut?
No, asking questions is the way to learn. But don't worry, my information is decades out of date so I won't "have to kill you".
I was topside, so I don't know too much about what went on below. I think they read and played cards. I do know that they monitored the alarms on the Launch Facilities (Silos), but there were no cameras around the minuteman sites. They also ran checks on the equipment, and briefed us before we went on patrol or checked out an alarm.
Back to the subject........
The scene in All The President's Men where "Woodward and Bernstien" were in the Library of Congress, going over the record of the books one of Nixon's guys checked out. I KNOW that this happened in real life, and the writer and director wanted to show how tough "uncovering the conspiracy" was, but it was really none of their business what he read and it had nothing to do with the Watergate thing! So what was the point? They could have just added some dialog saying that it was a dead-end lead.
"The Queen is testing poisons." CLEOPATRA, 1935 |
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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2007 : 10:22:47 PM
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I'd give you a little Damnation Alley for comparison but the only clip I could find was of Jan Michael Vincent singing(note the logo in the upper right hand corner).
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pphX78VAP8E"]Sing! You Sinners!!![/url]
As for All the President's Men, you're point is taken. The library book thing lead nowhere. And gave a flavor of what was to come.
In terms of historical accuracy, WHAT THE HELL? I saw a documentary about the Watergate scandal where they talked to all the of the major players. Liddy, Dean, Mitchell, Macgruder, Halderman, and Nixon and most of the stuff they talked about wasn't in All the President's Men. No mention of Don Segretti or using the CIA to tap Woodward's phone. Or worse, all that stuff about using the "entire intellegence community" for spying on the Democrats. We are definately in Billy Jack conspiracy theory territory.
Watching the real president's men, the feeling I got was a couple of guys(Dean, Liddy, Macgruder, and Mitchell) got together to try to figure out how to stop embarassing leaks and get a edge over democrats in the next election. So they came up with some ideas, most were very over the top. They scale it back to using 4 guys plus Liddy. All of their shenangans were failures. The final failure was being caught at the Watergate.
The part that brought down Nixon was he said he could get a million dollars in hush money for the people that got caught. And he said it while he was being recorded.
The rest is just legalese as this thing wound its way through the courts and congress.
What was Redford going for in his film? Billy Jack noteriety?
________________________________________________________________________
"Ward, the Beaver blew up the 7-11 again."
"I'll have a talk with him Dear" |
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Citizen Carrier
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
322 Posts |
Posted - 09/23/2007 : 8:14:15 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Capt. Nemo
Did it have anything to do with the plot?
Honestly, I don't recall.
I guess I should've said the setting and circumstances of the scene were "throw away", contrived, unrealistic and unnecessary, rather than if it aided in the plot somehow.
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RossM
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
427 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 08:01:23 AM
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In the Roger Moore james Bond movie octopussy there is a nice scene wher the woman Bond is tryign to seduce (or vice versa, a I cannot remember) escapes him by jumping out of a window and unrolling her sari that she is wearing. Its a cute scene, but we never see or hear from the woman again. It has nothing to do with anything else in the movie, a pure setpiece that could just as wee have been taken out and speeded up the movie.
rossM |
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Sardu
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1126 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 09:39:39 AM
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Now that you mention it, pretty much every Bond movie since the first few features an utterly throwaway opening scene which has nothing to do with the plot- it's just an action teaser with a big money stunt payoff to get to the credits. It's actually part of the formula. Kudos for Casino Royale, whatever its faults, to jettison it.
"Meeting you makes me want to be a real noodle cook"
--Tampopo |
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BT
Preeminent Apostolic Prelate of the Discipleship of Jabootu
USA
168 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 11:51:32 AM
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| technically, if you really think about it, Hannibal Lecter's entire escape sequence is a throwaway, as it has absolutely no effect whatsoever on the rest of the film, save for giving him the chance for a great closing line. |
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Greenhornet
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1791 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 8:13:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by RossM
In the Roger Moore james Bond movie octopussy there is a nice scene wher the woman Bond is tryign to seduce (or vice versa, a I cannot remember) escapes him by jumping out of a window and unrolling her sari that she is wearing. Its a cute scene, but we never see or hear from the woman again. It has nothing to do with anything else in the movie, a pure setpiece that could just as wee have been taken out and speeded up the movie.
Sorry Ross, but she was Octopussy's "second in command" (or something). She appiers in a tuxedo and hot pants at the circus later.
"The Queen is testing poisons." CLEOPATRA, 1935 |
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Mark Hawley
Minister of the Sacraments of Jabootu
Canada
48 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 8:28:33 PM
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| Actually the only Bond films that had opening sequences that didn't have anything to do with the rest of the plot are Goldfinger, Thunderball, For Your Eyes Only and Octopussy. |
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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 8:53:44 PM
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How about the "Shocking of the Nerd" scene in GhostBusters?
The one were Venkman is "Studying the effect of negative reinforcment on E.S.P. ability."
With a great one liner immediately following.
I can't find it.
So you guys will have to settle for this:
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja5oW-IkPVk"]Click here.[/url]
________________________________________________________________________
"Ward, the Beaver blew up the 7-11 again."
"I'll have a talk with him Dear" |
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Sardu
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
1126 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 9:01:39 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Capt. Nemo
How about the "Shocking of the Nerd" scene in GhostBusters?
The one were Venkman is "Studying the effect of negative reinforcment on E.S.P. ability."
With a great one liner immediately following.
But that was a character scene. It showed that Venkman didn't take the paranormal or his research seriously and that he was a hound for the girls. It really set him up. Didn't that scene basically introduce him in the film??
"Meeting you makes me want to be a real noodle cook"
--Tampopo |
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Capt. Nemo
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
630 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 9:10:00 PM
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Yeah, but it didn't go anywhere.
The girl or the guy didn't come back in to the film.
And he was fired from the university so the whole experiment didn't come back in to play.
It established Venkman's cynicial streak credentials in much the same way as the War Games scene in establishing the military's problems.
________________________________________________________________________
"Ward, the Beaver blew up the 7-11 again."
"I'll have a talk with him Dear" |
Edited by - Capt. Nemo on 09/24/2007 9:10:25 PM |
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